Daily Energy Standup Episode #193 – Nuclear’s Promise and Renewables’ Puzzle: Navigating the Energy Divide for a Greener Tomorrow

​ Critics say a pair of proposals to make Appalachian Ohio part of regional hydrogen hubs is likely to benefit the state’s oil and gas industry more than the climate. The two proposals are among […]

Highlights of the Podcast

00:00 – Intro02:42 – Is Nuclear Energy the Answers to a Sustainable Future? Experts are divided06:14 – At its current pace U.S. will Eliminate Fossil Fuels in 170 years 08:48 – White House on Alert Over Rising Fuel Prices13:15 – Renewable Energy has a brutal problem and no one that knows how to solve it 15:59 – Critics question how climate-friendly an Appalachian ‘blue’ hydrogen hub will be19:14 – Market Updates21:50 – Outro

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Video Transcription edited for grammar. We disavow any errors unless they make us look better or smarter.

Michael Tanner: [00:00:07] What is going on Everybody, Welcome into another edition of the Daily Energy News Beat Stand up here on this gorgeous Wednesday, August 23rd, 2023. As always, I’m your humble correspondent, Michael Tanner, coming to you from an undisclosed location here in Dallas, Texas, joined by the Executive Producer of the Show, the Purveyor of the Show and the Director and Publisher of the World’s Greatest Website, EnergyNewsBeat.com, Stuart Turley, my man, how we doing today? [00:00:30][23.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:00:31] Its Beautiful day in the Neighborhood. It is crazy out there buckle up, Batman. [00:00:35][4.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:00:36] Yeah, crazy story wise, crazy hot, I’m literally sweating in my own house, but we are surviving. We appreciate everybody checking this out as you mentioned, we have an excellent menu lined up for you. [00:00:47][10.7]

Michael Tanner: [00:00:47] First up, Is Nuclear Energy the answer to a sustainable future? Experts are divided. Ooh, dun dun dun. Next up, At Current Pace, U.S. Will Eliminate Fossil Fuels in 170 years that number seems more reasonable than 2030. So, Stu will dive into what this research is showing. [00:01:05][18.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:01:05] Next up, White House on Alert Over Rising Fuel Prices. Hello McFly. Hello, McFly. They’re finally waking up right now, we’ll see. Stu will impact is what’s going on with the Biden administration and rising fuel prices. And then finally, Renewable Energy has a brutal problem and no one knows how to solve it this is an opinion piece very interested to see what the author has to say specifically we love a good renewable energy story. [00:01:30][24.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:01:31] And then we have Critical Questions about How Climate Friendly Appalachian Blue hydrogen hub will be. So yeah, Stu couldn’t take an opportunity not to talk a little bit about blue hydrogen. So he’ll he’ll he’ll opine about what’s going on over there in Appalachian. He’ll toss it over to me really, it’s just oil prices and the API drops there crude oil inventory guesstimates for 10:30 here on Wednesday. So we will cover all that and a bag of chips in the finance section, guys. [00:01:58][27.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:01:58] But first, as always, check us out online World’s Greatest Website www.EnergyNewsBeat.com the best place for all of your Oil and Gas News. You can check us out on Spotify Apple Podcasts @EnergyNewsBeat.com YouTube check us out there. [00:02:13][15.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:02:15] Dashboard.EnergyNewsBeat.com the best place for all your Data and News Combo team is hard at work at V2. Check out the description if you’re listening on a Podcast or on YouTube, you can see the description for all the timestamps, so you could jump to whatever part you want to jump to. [00:02:28][13.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:02:30] If you want to get in contact with the show, email us Questions@EnergyNewsBeat.com or again, use that description below. I’ma turn it over to you tho Stu you where do you want to begin? [00:02:38][8.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:02:39] We’re going to do is Ill take, Is Nuclear Energy the Answers to a Sustainable Future? Experts are divided for $120, please. Thank you. Yeah. [00:02:50][10.8]

Michael Tanner: [00:02:51] I know you want to go 500 on that, but. All right. Talk to us about nuclear. What’s going. [00:02:55][4.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:02:55] On? Okay. You know, I think we got to end up don’t. If you don’t go Nuclear, you don’t go Natural gas you ain’t going to get there. So I found this one was pretty interesting I love this one. Michael Shellenberger We love us some Michael Shellenberger says, How do you provide Cheap, Reliable, Pollution free Energy for a world of 8 billion people? And nuclear energy is really the only scalable version of that renewables are not reliable, nor are they sustainable. This is Stuart Turley talking they are not sustainable financially. [00:03:30][34.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:03:31] So anyway, According to the report, there are 486 nuclear reactors either planned, proposed or under construction. I didn’t know it was that many, Michael. I mean, 65.9 billion watts of electric capacity, the highest amount since electric capacity under construction in the industry since 2015. The IEA, our buddies over there said in 2019, Nuclear is going away it’s too bad, it’s dangerous. It’s the only thing we got. [00:04:14][42.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:04:15] So but but what this article brings up is, okay, great, we’ve got all of this permitted and in the pipeline, why is it too expensive and why is it too slow? Well, I mean, that’s the thing that bogs down nuclear right now is cost overruns way too long takes to get these things on line. [00:04:33][18.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:04:34] And it is absolutely a disaster for Regulatory Issues causing delays, causing change orders, causing all these things. [00:04:47][13.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:04:47] Is that what it boils down to? Both of those come back to the point that it’s very hard to get these things approved. So as you work through the approval process, there’s constant, as you said, change orders. Oh, I hate that word. [00:04:59][12.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:05:00] Oh, no. Change Orders I lived and died. [00:05:02][2.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:05:03] We love a good change order what can I say? [00:05:05][2.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:05:05] Oh, yeah. I love a good change orders cause its the only way to make profit. And so when things are. So when others, if you don’t do the change order, you’re going to lose money. And so Greenpeace in March 22 was the position besides a commonly held you know, I just interviewed Patrick Moore again for the second time he’s coming back again he loves us. He’s a fan of the show. [00:05:34][29.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:05:35] But Greenpeace is now acknowledged all in nuclear power stations are score comparable with wind and solar energy. How wind and solar can be implemented much faster on a much bigger scale. And it’s because I got to admit you and I have said this before, the Biden administration is not they’re energy agnostic. They are not discriminatory against any energy source they have bad Regulatory processes for all of them. [00:06:07][32.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:06:08] Yeah, no kidding. All right. What’s next? [00:06:10][1.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:06:11] Let’s go to the current pace. At its current pace U.S. will Eliminate Fossil Fuels in 170 years the picture is a big old truck climbing up a coal heap. The thing that amazes me, Michael, is I absolutely the more we go to renewables, the more fossil fuels we’re going to need until the technology’s there. [00:06:37][25.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:06:38] According to data from the Energy Institute’s Statistical Review of World Energy. Well, there’s a mouthful I wonder what grant they got from Bubba Smith, Bill Gates amount of electrical generation from fossil fuels fell from 73% in 1985 to just under 60% in 2022. I’m going to call on that number right there. That is bull hockey crap. Baloney. While The New York Times likes to claim the country is rapidly shifting away from fossil fuels. It will take at current pace more than 170 years. [00:07:18][39.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:07:22] To reach 0% basically, if you extrapolate the difference going on, I mean, and between me and you, that number even seems small it seems reasonable, but it seems small. [00:07:32][10.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:07:33] Oh, no. And bear in mind that China is the one of the key issues here. U.S. fossil fuels peaked around 23,000 terawatt hours last year it was just under that 21 terawatt and then China is ramping up its energy production from fossil fuels. Everybody is putting in more coal in more ways than you can possibly imagine and then, naturally, LNG is here to stay. I mean, it’s just so much cheaper. [00:08:08][35.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:08:08] Even the IEA, they mention it in this article that they had to come out and admit that coal demand for electrical generation in steel production reached record highs in 2022. [00:08:17][8.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:08:19] And I got to give a shout out to the Cowboy State daily. I love them as a news source. They actually are one of the best news sources out there. Please go follow them. CowboyStateDaily.com. [00:08:29][10.8]

Michael Tanner: [00:08:32] All right. What’s next? [00:08:32][0.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:08:34] Oh, man, my old the pen boy here, He’s looking for his. Depends. Hey, did you see that? He offended everybody at Hawaii. [00:08:43][9.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:08:44] Fell asleep. I saw that’s ridiculous. [00:08:46][1.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:08:46] Oh, my gosh what a knucklehead. Rising gasoline prices in the US are starting to put pressure on the Biden Administration in the run up to next year’s election. Michael is I got to be nice. Diesel, meanwhile, has risen to 438 a gallon from 384 a month ago this is from Bob McNally. [00:09:09][22.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:09:09] Any White House has only two kinds of modes when it becomes to oil prices obvious or panic, said Bob McNally, President of Consultancy of Red Pan Energy and former Senior Director for International Energy for the White House National Security Council. [00:09:27][17.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:09:29] What would really flip them into true panic mode, Michael, is where, when oil prices kept rising with WTI at 92, $100, he says, that’ll really flip them out. The problem is, let me get some numbers here we are the largest sale they did a 180 million barrels. It currently holds 350 million barrels. That is the smallest it’s been in 45 years. [00:10:01][32.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:10:03] And so when you sit back, Saudi is cutting 1 million barrels a day. 100,000 here is not going to make a difference in no way to U.S. producers can fill the gap. They come down here and then even the Biden administration is bragging that U.S. is going to increase to 13 million barrels per day. So the hypocrisy of the Biden administration is just you got to congratulate them for hypocrisy in motion there. No. Now, if if they take this down, let me just give my Stuart Turley Opinion. [00:10:39][35.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:10:40] Closures?. [00:10:40][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:10:41] Okay. China, when things go bad, right. Things are going bad the economy is going bad in China what does China do? They normally everybody has started a war. Look, that’s and then they go over here and start a war they could be starting a war in Taiwan. [00:11:01][20.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:11:03] What are we going to do if we got a war in Taiwan besides having a knucklehead up there, you know, that doesn’t even know where he’s at or he’s they’re saying that his oh what was the joke that he said yesterday? He almost lost his car and his wife and his dog or something like that. I mean, it was pathetic. [00:11:24][21.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:11:25] What’s going to happen is we only have 350 million. How many do many millions a day do we use in the U.S.? That is less than a 20 day supply that is less than that. You get anybody at OPEC grouped out of. Russia is now also going to cut at 1 million barrels per day 100,000. I mean, a million barrels a day. What was it Russia doing? I got a fact check myself. They are going all in on this next OPEC+ cut they’re going in. So. [00:12:00][35.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:12:02] Yeah. I mean, I’m if if war with China starts, we’re screwed that’s all I’ll say. Gas prices are going through the roof. [00:12:12][9.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:12:14] And even if China. [00:12:15][1.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:12:15] Store it, they’re ready for this. [00:12:17][1.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:12:18] Huh? Oh, they’re ready for oil. [00:12:20][2.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:12:20] They’re ready for this. It’s scary. [00:12:21][1.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:12:22] They’ve been buying everything they could they bought more gold than they could have ever made. Bricks is meeting today or yesterday. BRICS is in this meeting you had all the representatives from China, South America, Brazil, India, meeting with Xi in China. And the big question is, are they going to be able to do it? And my answer is yes. [00:12:47][24.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:12:48] They’ve been doing this since, I believe, 2009 on BRICS, trying to bring it forward. Guess what the catalyst was? It was Biden. Do you remember that one quote that I got to go to the next story here. You remember when Obama said don’t ever underestimate the ability for Joe Biden to f up something? [00:13:08][20.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:13:09] Yeah, I do remember that. [00:13:10][1.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:13:10] Okay. Yeah, he just left up the U.S. Dollar. Let’s go over here to the Renewable Energy has a brutal problem and no one that knows how to solve it. Let’s put Biden in charge of it. It’s not an equation that was a joke, Michael. Sorry. It is not a question of whether or not there’s enough energy available from the sun, wind or waves or whatever it is the question for what is needed for the underlying engineering, the batteries, the Wind Farms, the Solar Plants, etc., etc.. As a cartoon once said, there’s a couple of stats in here they’re just amazing. Let’s see… [00:13:53][42.8]

Michael Tanner: [00:13:54] By Stephen Sidley from Daily Maverick.co Love. [00:13:59][5.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:13:59] Yeah. The largest and most expensive has been the multinational lithium project in France. It was designed to be completed in 2001 and began in 2007. Was the first fusion experiments in 2035 and begin fusion and it has to come up to scale with usefulness. [00:14:23][23.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:14:24] This is about Fusion Energy, Fusion Energy is not anywhere any time soon. It’s going to be modular reactors and it’s going to be semis. You know, those other ones the Fusion has it’s that is the energy nirvana. It ain’t going to get there. So when you sit here and take a look at the technology for renewables is not there. [00:14:51][26.8]

Michael Tanner: [00:14:51] We said this its not a matter of how much wind it is. You know, Stephen put it very plainly, it’s not about how much energy we can get and extract from all renewable sources. It’s where does it go and how does the grid handle it? No one has answered that question. [00:15:08][16.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:15:09] No. And no. [00:15:10][1.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:15:10] An I know who will! [00:15:10][0.3]

Stuart Turley: [00:15:11] Well, more than 500,000 medium sized non fossil power plants will have to be built to replace the current fossil fuel fleet by 2050. Let me say it again. 500,000 medium non fossil power plants will have to be built. [00:15:32][20.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:15:34] Thats Insane, again not going to happen. [00:15:37][2.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:15:37] Now, what was that, Dana Carvey? Not going to happen when he would imitate Bush. Okay. Critic this one. You know, Michael, three years ago when you and I were talking on our show, I was always a hydrogen fan I was Dr. Hydrogen. I mean, I almost sounded like a James Bond character. [00:15:57][20.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:15:58] Yessir. [00:15:58][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:15:59] Critics Question How Climate Friendly and Appalachian Blue, as you would say, hydrogen hub will be. Okay. The Porkulus bill I mean, excuse me the Inflation Reduction Bill came out and added in there has to be two hydrogen plants installed. One of them is going to be in the Appalachia area. And it had to be in an area where there’s a lot of natural gas. So the Appalachia Mountain, which is the area over there with CNN and Nick, we loved CNX,. [00:16:34][35.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:16:36] We do. [00:16:36][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:16:38] Appalachia Region Green clean energy hydrogen hub. Here’s the problem. Let’s see. It is, Rob. But we believe there are opportunities for the industry in a regional hub or hydrogen ecosystem that the Appalachia is more suited than most areas because of our compactness access to natural gas and manufacturing infrastructure. Well, he’s he’s got that right. President of the Ohio Oil and Gas Association. There is certainty that would be a benefit, especially the role of natural gas and the creation of blue hydrogen. But we think it’s too early to tell exactly what and how much benefit it will be to the industry he’s dead on right. [00:17:21][43.8]

Michael Tanner: [00:17:22] Yep. [00:17:22][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:17:22] Here’s where blue hydrogen is. It’s made with natural gas, blue hydrogen, natural gas green hydrogen is made with renewables wind or solar doesn’t happen very often. Hydrogen takes a tremendous amount of water. I mean, we’re going to be facing we’re all facing this water shortage. Oh, well, there’s plenty of water for hydrogen. It would even result in a net reduction of carbon emissions there is a question whether or not would it would even happen. [00:17:56][34.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:17:58] There is also a danger that I really never talked about in the past, and that’s the molecules are smaller, not my brain size. It is that molecules are smaller. So when you try to pump these bad dogs in, it’s saying over here, we want to go ahead and use all natural gas pipelines. [00:18:14][16.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:18:15] I used to be all in on that. It leaks. It’s kind of like our border it’s just wide open and I mean, it’s absolutely going to cause a problem. Things blow up when hydrogen I mean, what are we going to do, call, you know, that whole area? [00:18:32][17.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:18:33] Call Ghostbusters. [00:18:33][0.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:18:34] Yeah, We’re going to call Pennsylvania instead of Pennsylvania. We’re going to call it the Hindenburg, Pennsylvania instead of the Hindenburg, because it’s going to blow up. [00:18:43][8.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:18:44] That’s funny. No, I mean, I think I talked about this on my solo show last night. I’m not sure if I want to be riding around with a with a nuclear bomb in my car. [00:18:53][9.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:18:55] A hydrogen. [00:18:55][0.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:18:56] Bomb in my car. Yeah, I know. I’ll pass. I’ll let somebody else try that one out. [00:19:02][5.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:19:03] Well. I had a joke, but never mind. There was a little college humor kick. [00:19:10][7.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:10] Kick in finance? [00:19:11][0.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:19:12] Kick it to finance, dude. [00:19:13][1.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:14] All right, Well, we’ll keep it short, folks, because. Because nothing really happened today other than we had a little bit of a sideways trading day. We did actually finish trading day below $80 at 79,65 as we record this at 6:14 on the 22nd. [00:19:29][15.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:30] We did see the overall markets, S&P down about a quarter of a percentage point. NASDAQ dropped about 2/10 of a percentage point, yields up Dollar Index up about a quarter of a percentage point. Natural gas, again, sideways, trading $2.56. [00:19:44][13.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:45] Everything comes down to China, China, China, China, China that’s all you’re going to hear coming out of, you know, the news industry, whether or not that’s you know, and again, we’re back in sentiment, both supply and demand. [00:19:58][12.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:58] You know, we did see the API come out, Stu, and they’re going to draw and they claim today, if you’re listening to this on Wednesday, that you’ll see a 2.4 million barrel draw that’s at 10,30 but the API’s recommending 2.4 million barrel draw so we’ll see what happens there. [00:20:13][14.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:20:13] But again, fundamentals have kind of shifted back towards it’s the sentiment of where China goes so well. Oil, remember, we had a few weeks where everybody was we were talking about how fundamental supply and demand backs do thrown out the window we’re back on China now. [00:20:26][12.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:20:27] Well, China and his other brother, Taiwan, you know, that was The Bob Newhart Show years ago. [00:20:33][5.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:20:33] You’re killing me. Anything else you got for them? [00:20:35][2.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:20:36] Yeah. BRICS is finishing up their meetings we’ll have an update on BRICS. We also. [00:20:42][5.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:20:42] How we’ve got there in Jackson Hole on Friday right? [00:20:45][2.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:20:48] Ahh No! [00:20:48][0.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:20:49] I thought Jay Powell and the Fed’s in Jackson Hole they have comments on Friday? [00:20:52][3.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:20:52] I said BRICS. [00:20:53][0.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:20:54] Oh, but I was talking about Jay Powell and. [00:20:56][1.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:20:57] Now you’re now you’re treating me like a husband you’re not listening to me. I mean, it’s just. [00:21:03][5.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:21:04] I know BRICS is meeting spooky. [00:21:06][2.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:21:07] It it is now, the other one is the Fed we’re going to hear it. I have a feeling they could even continue to raise rates they’re that bad. [00:21:15][7.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:21:16] Yeah, it’s it’s. It’s not looking good. [00:21:19][2.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:21:19] No. And then Russia is going to be cutting their oil supply and then there’s about 16 other things going on that I’ll be filling people in on. [00:21:29][9.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:21:30] But guess what? This is the Best Podcast to stay updated on everything in the Energy Business. But with that, guys, we’re going to let you get out of here get back to work we Appreciate you check this out. For Stuart Turley. I’m Michael Tanner. We’ll see you tomorrow, folks. [00:21:30][0.0]

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